Huntmaster -V- VB

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Danny.Lee
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Huntmaster -V- VB

Postby Danny.Lee » Thu Sep 27, 2012 7:53 am

Here is a request for informed opinion.

My basket case VB turns out to have started life as a 650 Huntmaster according to the club archivist. I now have
a problem, do I spend a load of money re-building an incomplete and very worn VB engine, or do I use the cash to buy
a Huntmaster engine?

Does anyone have a spare Huntmaster engine for sale?

I understand the Huntmaster is a virtual copy of the BSA A10, does anyone know if there are differences
that prevent using an A10 engine in an Ariel frame without major surgery?

Regards
Danny Lee

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Eero.Korhonen
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Re: Huntmaster -V- VB

Postby Eero.Korhonen » Thu Sep 27, 2012 8:22 am

Hi,
With that twin engine it would be much more power and fun.
Only difference is the timing case, if I am correct.
Br, Eero
Ariel VH 1954, IZH 350 1962, H-D Sportster Hugger 1992, AOMCC Member 133

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Re: Huntmaster -V- VB

Postby john.nash » Thu Sep 27, 2012 9:47 am

Depends what you want ?
If you are pulling a chair or pottering about at 45/50mph then a VB is fine.

I converted my VB to an VH, just by putting on a OHV barrel/piston and head (you may need a compression plate under the barrel to ensure the piston doesn't hit the valves; the VB stroke is longer). That might be the way cheaper and easier option for you.
You will also need a new downpipe and exhaust and carburettor ( I put on a new concentric). Everything else is fine.

The only struggle might be in finding an OHV 500 head and barrel.
There was an engine in cheval, a few months back, for £550 and I bought one from a chap ( in kent) for £350 a little while back.
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2009 royal Enfield,1978 t140 bonneville, '67 CJ750, 196-ish Ural M62 outfit, 1960 k750, ''51 kH500, ''49 soon to be Ariel bobber, 47 VH twinport, '44 Ariel WNG, '43 Ariel WNG, '41 Ariel WNG and piles of rusty scrap ....

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Keith.owen
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Re: Huntmaster -V- VB

Postby Keith.owen » Thu Sep 27, 2012 10:26 am

John,
I am not attempting to highjack the discussion since this is about converting a bike (back to) a huntmaster. BUT I am curios to know how your long stroke VH worked out? How does it compare with a normal (shorter stroke) VH?

Just curious!!

Keith :mrgreen:
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Postby john.nash » Thu Sep 27, 2012 10:47 am

I have the longer stroke/VB on an iron engine in a rigid. I have an alloy engine 500 hitched to a light sidecar

To be fair, it would be tough to tell the difference performance wise.
John "Josh" Nash
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2009 royal Enfield,1978 t140 bonneville, '67 CJ750, 196-ish Ural M62 outfit, 1960 k750, ''51 kH500, ''49 soon to be Ariel bobber, 47 VH twinport, '44 Ariel WNG, '43 Ariel WNG, '41 Ariel WNG and piles of rusty scrap ....

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Re: Huntmaster -V- VB

Postby Eero.Korhonen » Thu Sep 27, 2012 11:12 am

Hi John,
Do you have pics about these? I like to see how this is done.
Br, Eero
Ariel VH 1954, IZH 350 1962, H-D Sportster Hugger 1992, AOMCC Member 133

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brenton.roy
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Postby brenton.roy » Thu Sep 27, 2012 1:20 pm

Hi Danny, it's not hard to convert back to a twin, but mostly I'd think it comes down to how much you are willing to spend (as always).
You would need the complete motor (including engine electrics, carb etc.) and primary drive plus cases, engine plates and exhaust.
I have learnt all this recently (see KH post)..
You might be lucky enough to find a good motor, but you would expect to have to do some work.
The A10 is basically the same motor as the Ariel. I couldn't list the differences, but I think they are minor / cosmetic. Engine internals are the same.
A huntmaster would be worth more than a VB, so you will recoup some of the cost later - plus what you get for the VB motor.
A good Huntmaster will apparently do over 100mph. The one I had wouldn't, but it did go a lot better than a VB - or most singles for that matter.

On the other hand, VB rebuilds are quite cheap. The big end is easy to get and cheaper than one for a VH, ball type mains (also cheaper) - pistons and rings are more or less given away on ebay, as are valves.
You could always have a go at tuning the VB?
regards, Brenton
'51,'56 Squares, '48 VH, '27 Model C, R67/2, Mk IV Le Mans, '06 Super Duke and Ariel projects.

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Postby Danny.Lee » Thu Sep 27, 2012 2:10 pm

Hi all thanks for the responses, some interesting points made. My position is I bought the bike for the fun of the re-build, rather than as a 'riding' motorcycle, and would look to sell it on when complete, buy another wreck and do the whole thing over. Profit is not the aim, but making it a self financing hobby would not go amiss. I settled on an Ariel deliberately for reasons going back 40 years, and I intend to stick with the make, though I have no particular favourite model. If I ever keep one for me it will probably be a pre-war 500, but right now, I couldnt afford one.

My questions are based on that premiss, so I was wondering if there was any strong feeling in favour of returning a bike to its original state, or would a 'bitza' be just as acceptable, all other considerations being equal?. Would the Huntmaster be more attractive (better price) to the market than the VB, and given the obvious diff in likely costs of re-build would it make financial sense. I should say my VB engine is wrecked, it needs pretty much everything to make a reliable engine again and I wouldnt want to pass it on to anyone with anything less. (the only bits that dont need attention are the cranckcase castings...)

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brenton.roy
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Postby brenton.roy » Thu Sep 27, 2012 2:53 pm

Hi Danny, You'll get more for matching numbers - at least for the year. The same frame number prefixes spread across models in the 50's.
Unless you are dead lucky, I think the 650 idea could get quite expensive. You'd have to factor in the extra cost of the rebuild, plus missing parts.
500's go for quite a lot more money than 350's or 600's. Getting hold of the engine parts is the problem because everyone else is trying to do the same thing...
You might spend AU$ 1000 to 1500 on a complete VH motor, half that on a top end.
A lot of us wouldn't break even on the cost of a restoration, particularly if you have to buy the bike.
'51,'56 Squares, '48 VH, '27 Model C, R67/2, Mk IV Le Mans, '06 Super Duke and Ariel projects.

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Postby PeterW » Thu Sep 27, 2012 9:17 pm

I'd fit an A10 engine, RR cams, alloy guards and rear-sets :¬) Its not going to make you rich whichever way you go so might as well have some fun.


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