48 VH Front Wheel Bearings

Anything about Ariels
JerryTapscott
Posts: 41
Joined: Wed Jan 31, 2018 2:30 pm
Contact:

48 VH Front Wheel Bearings

Postby JerryTapscott » Tue May 15, 2018 10:49 am

I'm going to replace the bearings in my front wheel - most likely with a set of these sealed bearings:

https://www.feked.com/front-wheel-beari ... -four.html

The question I have is that with these being sealed, will I be disposing of the grease retaining seals (4042-46 is the left hand one) which would sit against the original bearings? Or do they have to go back in even though they wouldn't actually be doing anything?

I was wondering whether they are needed to fill a void between the lock ring and the bearing. If they are I'll order a new set as well as the bearings because I hate to start a job and find myself a part short on a Saturday afternoon.

Would there be any other bits I ought to obtain before starting the bearing replacement? Like certain washers or seals that are always mangled?

Finally, would it be the case that drifting the old bearings out should be fairly straightforward but installing the new ones will need a visit to a workshop with a bearing press?

User avatar
simon.holyfield
Holder of a Golden Anorak
Holder of a Golden Anorak
Posts: 2694
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2011 11:16 pm
Location: Norfolk
Contact:

Re: 48 VH Front Wheel Bearings

Postby simon.holyfield » Tue May 15, 2018 10:58 am

This might help Jerry:

http://ariel-square-four.blogspot.co.uk ... 4-mk1.html

The old seals are no longer required. The bit that catches you out is the top-hat spacer - Drags supply two RMS6 bearings and a new spacer usually, except that it was out of stock when I put my wheel together. I ended up using two new bearings to the old spec (except that I used 2RS sealed bearings) and I reused the top-hat spacer.
cheers

Simes

'51 Square Four, Masquerading D3 Bantam, '58 Huntmaster, '42 W/NG, http://ariel-square-four.blogspot.com

JerryTapscott
Posts: 41
Joined: Wed Jan 31, 2018 2:30 pm
Contact:

Re: 48 VH Front Wheel Bearings

Postby JerryTapscott » Tue May 15, 2018 12:35 pm

Thanks for that Simon, a really useful article. I must admit I'm a tad confused now about the top hat - as in, do the sealed bearings offered by Feked dispense with the top hat altogether? Drags seem to offer bearings that include a sleeve for the right hand side so I'm thinking that ordering these two parts should do the trick:

https://www.draganfly.co.uk/index.php/a ... duct/7372-

https://www.draganfly.co.uk/index.php/a ... duct/9228-

On your blog you don't mention a bearing press at all - were you able to get the bearings into position without using a press? I'm all for ghetto engineering so if I can do it with a socket and a mallet I will! When I changed the bearings on a mountainbike I put them in the freezer for two days beforehand, and then fitted them after pouring hot water on the frame.

User avatar
simon.holyfield
Holder of a Golden Anorak
Holder of a Golden Anorak
Posts: 2694
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2011 11:16 pm
Location: Norfolk
Contact:

Re: 48 VH Front Wheel Bearings

Postby simon.holyfield » Tue May 15, 2018 12:44 pm

You're right Jerry - Drags do offer bearings that include the sleeve - the problem was, the sleeve was out of stock when I received my bearings from them, so I removed the old top hat sleeve, put one of the Drags bearings (11/16" wide) on the shelf and bought another bearing to replace the original (9/16" wide). I put the old top hat back in this narrow bearing.

You don't need a press. They are a relatively easy transition fit, or a very tight clearance fit - a big socket will do.
cheers

Simes

'51 Square Four, Masquerading D3 Bantam, '58 Huntmaster, '42 W/NG, http://ariel-square-four.blogspot.com

JerryTapscott
Posts: 41
Joined: Wed Jan 31, 2018 2:30 pm
Contact:

Re: 48 VH Front Wheel Bearings

Postby JerryTapscott » Tue May 15, 2018 1:52 pm

That's great, thanks for the info. I'll get some on order from Drags and get them in this weekend.

JerryTapscott
Posts: 41
Joined: Wed Jan 31, 2018 2:30 pm
Contact:

Re: 48 VH Front Wheel Bearings

Postby JerryTapscott » Fri May 25, 2018 11:51 am

Well, this isn't exactly going to plan (as I expected, tbh).

I ordered a bearing set from Drags... and waited. Eventually I phoned and found out they don't have any in stock (I assume it was the top hat spacer they were talking about). This despite the fact that their website said "excellent stock level." I think what they meant was "no stock level."

OK, never mind, order the "VH Front Wheel Bearing Kit" from Feked. This one:

https://www.feked.com/front-wheel-beari ... -four.html

Now, being a bit of an engineering numpty I just removed both of the old bearings and pressed the new ones into the wheel. They fitted fine. Then I put the wheel back on the bike. Of course, because the spindle diameter steps down the bearing on the right (brake side) was wildly oversize and the wheel had an inch of side to side drift!

Now even my limited engineering skills spotted this one. Righto, thinks I, I need to reuse that top hat spacer. So, top hat successfully removed from old bearing. Offer top hat up to new bearing and... no way is it going in. The inner diameter of the new bearing is 4mm smaller than the OD of the top hat.

So what I have is, to my untrained eye, two left hand bearings. The original right hand bearing is narrower and has a larger ID. Am I doing something ridiculously wrong here or am I going to have to bin one of the bearings and do what you did Simon, which is to source a bearing which is the same dimensions as the original RH bearing? If this is the case, it makes me wonder why that size isn't just supplied in the first place. Unless of course I've missed something like "use these bearings with the special spindle we supply".

Simon, could you let me know what size RH bearing you bought in the end? With a link if at all poss, thanks.

Finally, I have to say that on the LH side of the spindle (where the bearings do actually fit) there appears to be the slightest amount of play, and measuring the spindle reveals the area where the bearing sits is around .005" down compared to the central area of the spindle. What's an acceptable amount of wear, any ideas?

Looking at the Feked Ariel wheel bearings on offer, some of the other sets do seem to have two different sized bearings, which is what I would have expected for the set that I ordered from them:

https://www.feked.com/wheels/wheel-bear ... -bearings/

User avatar
simon.holyfield
Holder of a Golden Anorak
Holder of a Golden Anorak
Posts: 2694
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2011 11:16 pm
Location: Norfolk
Contact:

Re: 48 VH Front Wheel Bearings

Postby simon.holyfield » Fri May 25, 2018 12:57 pm

JerryTapscott wrote:Simon, could you let me know what size RH bearing you bought in the end? With a link if at all poss, thanks.


Should be in the blog post, Jerry.

I can support more later - typing with thumbs at the mo.
cheers

Simes

'51 Square Four, Masquerading D3 Bantam, '58 Huntmaster, '42 W/NG, http://ariel-square-four.blogspot.com

Simon.Gardiner
Holder of a Waxed Cotton Anorak
Holder of a Waxed Cotton Anorak
Posts: 540
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 11:37 pm
Location: South West (Bristol-ish)
Contact:

Re: 48 VH Front Wheel Bearings

Postby Simon.Gardiner » Fri May 25, 2018 1:16 pm

JerryTapscott wrote:Looking at the Feked Ariel wheel bearings on offer, some of the other sets do seem to have two different sized bearings, which is what I would have expected for the set that I ordered from them:

https://www.feked.com/wheels/wheel-bear ... -bearings/


Rear wheel set should surely be a pair of standard 1" shaft ball bearings?
Oh lordy, don't say what they're showing as the rear wheel set is actually the front wheel set and the 'front' wheel set is actually for t'other end....

(Jerry, I'd have to bin that spindle and fit a new one. My bikes always failed the MOT if there was any play of the spindle in the bearing, it translates to free play at the wheel rim which isn't allowable.)

SG
'55 Huntmaster, '56 VH, ' 51 VH, '80 R100RT, '00 Sprint ST (but all those Ariel parts can only make one running bike...)

User avatar
simon.holyfield
Holder of a Golden Anorak
Holder of a Golden Anorak
Posts: 2694
Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2011 11:16 pm
Location: Norfolk
Contact:

Re: 48 VH Front Wheel Bearings

Postby simon.holyfield » Fri May 25, 2018 1:32 pm

Heaven knows why Drags don't just list the proper sizes and ask people to knock the spacer out. Maybe most spacers are more difficult to remove than mine.

For the brake side bearing, you need a RLS7 2RS, which is 2" OD, 7/8" ID and 9/16" thick with two soft seals. Hopefully this link will work:

cheers

Simes

'51 Square Four, Masquerading D3 Bantam, '58 Huntmaster, '42 W/NG, http://ariel-square-four.blogspot.com

JerryTapscott
Posts: 41
Joined: Wed Jan 31, 2018 2:30 pm
Contact:

Re: 48 VH Front Wheel Bearings

Postby JerryTapscott » Fri May 25, 2018 1:59 pm

Simon G - yes I think Feked have sold me a set of rear wheel bearings. The ones I have are never going to work.

Simon H - because I now have lost confidence in what Feked have sold me would you be able to let me know the correct size for the left (non-brake side) bearing as well so that I can get one of these at the same time?

I've got a new stainless spindle on order, Can't say I have a lot of faith in what's on the bike as I can slide the bearing on to it and rock it around.

Of course all of this would explain the bike's distinctly wayward handling!


Return to “Ariel Talk”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests